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Audacity of Truth
Gaffetastic:
Vice President Joe Biden had his “oops” moment Wednesday speaking in a 49er-crazed SF when he told a crowd at a city political fundraiser that “the Giants are on their way to the Super Bowl.” - SF Chronicle, 1-18-12
Study: Abortions at home are “safe”
Hey, soon it may be as easy as one, two, three:
Women who are less than nine weeks pregnant can safely have medical abortions at home, according to the head of a government-backed pilot project.
Abortion services for the 20,000 women who seek a chemically induced abortion every year could be transformed should the Department of Health’s official evaluation of the pilot confirm initial findings. But it is also likely to provoke controversy from anti-abortion campaigners who will claim that home abortions would make the procedure easier and therefore lead to more women having terminations.
Shirley Butler, the project manager of one pilot which has tested the abortions with 172 women patients since 2004, told the Guardian: “We haven’t had any significant problems apart from one woman who had a slightly heavy bleed. In my opinion medical abortions outside of acute hospitals seem to be safe.” She added that women who took part in the trial were positive about it.
These “at home” abortions will be even more convenient than the chemical abortion ‘option’ that is offered in the UK. How do the chemical abortions work? Well, it takes a couple of days for the drugs to take effect on the fetus, but eventually the dosages – um – ‘pay off’:
Chemical abortions are available before the 12th week of pregnancy. Women who request it take one tablet of mifepristone at a hospital then return two days later to take four doses of misoprostol which causes a termination within hours. Usually women remain in hospital after taking the second pills until the abortion is complete. Under the trials they took both sets of pills within local community clinics to test the theory that it is safe to be outside hospital, and therefore at home.
One of these days they’ll be setting up QwikPillMarts where a gal can just run in, purchase the necessary pills, dash home and start the process of aborting an unwanted child – and the process can be underway while she’s cooking dinner, reading a book, sleeping … so easy, and it doesn’t take any time out of the day to do. How — efficient!
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89 Responses to “Study: Abortions at home are “safe””
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Baklava wrote: “I use his comments as a jumping ground to:…”
I know. I was doing the same. I wanted to make my “moral freeloading” comment and chose you as my sounding board. Feel free to continue to do the same.
Andrew said:
Are you just being snarky, or has your time here really taught you nothing about conservatism? All conservatives want is for the mother AND the child to ‘not face harm’. If you really don’t understand that then you just don’t WANT to understand it.
As I’ve said, I’m ambivalent about abortion, but at least I understand both sides of the issue. You are doing yourself a disservice by not doing the same. Trying to paint conservatives as uncaring on an issue where they are trying to save 100% more lives than liberals is just silly. MORE than 100% if you add in multiple births.
Said andrewSafe abortions really piss off the wingnuts. How dare women not face harm?
Comment by andrew @ 2/17/2006 – 8:37 pm
Where did you get the idea that this was safe? How safe can a chemical be to a woman when it kills a baby inside? What else is it eating away at? I am sure we will find out in about 5 years.
Pam, probably safer then living in the Los Angeles smog. Now, smog is an issue you life-givers should be able to wrap your tiny little minds around. Smog kills! That requires a constitutiona amendment to outlaw! Peace
“No andrew… what pisses me off is no-class idiots like you that troll and spam Conservative blogs because you just can’t seperate your personal issues from your politics and you post things like you just did. Sis has a lot more patience for that kind of crap than I would.”
Safe abortions are cause for applause then? great!
Where would you be Andrew if these pills were available to your mom???
I think a new sloan is in order after that comment:
“Abort a Liberal and Save Lives!”
RightWing, so your pro-abortion, you won’t get on well here. Peace
“Where would you be Andrew if these pills were available to your mom???”
Still here. I was a wanted child.
I like how the 8 year old amongst us is declaring that our minds our tiny.
As far as this pill being safe please see my above post. This pill kills. Also it is not like the present abortion providers have never had a woman die on their tables or bleed out due to an abortion procedure. So they are not 100% safe. It simply is not bada boom bada bing there you go Honey all done. I have had several friends who have had serious complications due to abortions. One will never be able to have children again. It is time for a serious discussion on this topic, not the heated argument we have had in the past. – Lorica
- So you got yours and screw every other baby to be, huh Andrew. Nice cynical amoral, asocial view point. Tell me that leftist meme about “uncaring neocons” again. I think I must have missed your point somehow.
- Bang
“So you got yours and screw every other baby to be, huh Andrew. ”
We’re not talking about whether to have abortions. Just whether they should be safe or not. Like I said: wingnuts bitch that they’re safe.
Safe abortions hmm?
Tell it to them:
Link
Oh here is a bit on if they can’t get a legal abortion they will get it by coathanger or less reputable means:
IF you took the time to read through all this, I would be happy to hear some of your arguements for legal, supposedly ‘safe’ abortions.
I will not post the pictures because even as a grown man, and a father, I cannot look at abortions or cruelty to children without it seriously tearing me up. But if you wish to peruse the pictures of how an abortion is down, including partial-birth abortions, I will post you a link.
Let me know.
Lorica, I think steve was being snarky towards women. steve is just a chauvinist. LORD knows his spelling is horrid, so it may be a mistake.
andrew, abortions that are safe … well, they won’t be mine, as a male can’t have one. But link to one that is safe. RU-486 has been proven to be a health problem. This new one is being rushed through testing, not because it’s a life-saver, but for political reasons. Show me the safe abortion drug/procedure. Give us the link, please. Reality
“IF you took the time to read through all this, I would be happy to hear some of your arguements for legal, supposedly ‘safe’ abortions.”
They should be made safer. Agreed?
I know what you said Andrew. I reject it out of hand as being the usual crap Liberals like to toss around. Got it?
- Bang
The thing thats so dumb about your arguments, well theres too many to list actually…. but one glaring example is your own phelandering idol slick Willey said it best:
“Abortions should be safe, legal, and rare”
- Bang
- Philandering – PIMF
“”Abortions should be safe, legal, and rare”"
They should be as rare as people want them. I trust women to decide. Not politics.
Then Andrew, each individual state should let the PEOPLE vote as to whether they want them to be preformed in their state and not force us to have them. But nooooo can’t have that now can we. – Lorica
As Women Decide, but then you have groups such as NARAL and Planned Prenthood giving them wrong information and outright lying to women.
A Nation of Hurting Women
“Nearly 80% of the women surveyed believed they were denied information or were actively misinformed by their counselors prior to their abortions … nearly 50% complained that they were not told about fetal development.”
You want to start somewhere, start with councelors, those who are suppose to be helping these women, yet only seem to be interested in filling some unknown quota (sarcasm).
Then have licensed doctors specifically for these procedures, and make them go through extensive training, since we fiund these safe abortions are not so safe, we just are fed this, but find out otherwise as you can read above.
Also I think a woman should have some counceling with someone who is NOT associated with NARAL, or Planned Parenthood or even a right to life person. Someone who is generally interested in the well-being of the woman and the baby she carries and who will sit down and talk with earnest of the real dangers that could happen with her if she goes through the process and how it may affect her life.
If the woman is still bent on having an abortion after that THEN, it should be her right, but she should only have that right after she is equipped with the proper knowledge and FULLY understands what the possibilities hold for her if she has this procedure.
Also, not sure if it is, but I do not want this as state or federally funded. This is a procedure option she is choosing, UNLESS it can be proven it is life or death or in cases of Rape or Incest. All other cases I think the mother woman should have to pay for a optional procedure to child birth- abortion.
Does that seem more reasonable?
- Andrew I can’t tell you the number of woman I’ve heard say they have deep regrets for having aborted their babies. Thats with no real effort to research he subject on my part, which probably indicates what we actually know about is just the tip of the iceburg. A number of the so called “womens choice groups” have all the earmarks of outside the mainstream mysogonistic men/children haters, or other shady agenda’s. I wouldn’t trust them as far as I could throw them. The last thing in this world anyone should want is a choice of life and death being left to someone with an anti-life attitude to begin with. All abortions should be determined by physicians. Period.
Oh and btw…. you say you don’t want abortions to be decided by politics. What the hell do you think groups like NARAL are, sewing clubs. Its the same old story. Everytime you try to follow a Liberals position on anything it always comes down to supporting whatever gives you an escape hatch for personal responsibility. You say you want the woman to decide. How can she decide when shes being fed a skewed anti-life viewpoint at the very time when shes the most emotional and needs the very best of advice, not a warped asocial agenda based on NARAL type brain washing. Its all just more “progressive” BS.
- Bang
“Then Andrew, each individual state should let the PEOPLE vote as to whether they want them to be preformed in their state and not force us to have them. But nooooo can’t have that now can we. – Lorica”
That’s not letting women decide. That’s letting political majorities decide. I trust individual women. Not political majorities.
“Does that seem more reasonable?”
I think the choice should be informed. Sure. Run you commercials and make your case. But individual women decide.
“- Andrew I can’t tell you the number of woman I’ve heard say they have deep regrets for having aborted their babies.”
Well, they decided wrong then. There’s no way to guarantee that doesn’t happen.
- I just wonder sometimes what all the millions of babies that have been aborted under your “freedom to choose” rules since Roe versus Wade, would have to say to you if they were alive now and knew you wated them dead. Great platform to run your Liberal leaders on isn’t it. I’ll tell you what I think is going to happen. As more and more middle America comes to understand what you asshats have been up to for the past 30 years, you’re not going to be able to win any National elections for generations.
- Bang
“Well, they decided wrong then. There’s no way to guarantee that doesn’t happen.”
No. Theres no way to gaurentee it. But starting off with honest conseling, un-skewed consoling, has got to be better. You can’t gaurentee you won’t be run over tomorrow either. But chances are if you don’t play in the middle of a freeway, your prospects for living will be much improved.
Anyway, as usual your arguments make no sense, and I have to believe thats why you cherry pick and never respond to any points that show your weakness on the issues.
- Bang
Where is everyone getting the idea that this procedure is safer that going to the clinic? We are discussing a 2 step procedure in ENGLAND in which the woman goes and gets one drug, takes it and then approximately 2 days later must go back to the hospital, obviously for observation, while the baby is expelled. This is nothing more than inducing a miscarriage to happen. The problem with the scenario is the fact that this is particular statement, which negates the at-home scenario, because the only thing you did at home was take the first pill:
Usually women remain in hospital after taking the second pills until the abortion is complete. Under the trials they took both sets of pills within local community clinics to test the theory that it is safe to be outside hospital, and therefore at home.
So now we went from a 2 hour procedure at the local abortion clinic, to a 3-4 day ordeal.
The study doesn’t touch base on allegies.
How many of the women tested have been successful in getting pregnant again?
How many that have been successful in getting pregnant again have had children with birth defects?
See Andrew that is the problem. You see the people as a political party. That just isn’t true. The Founding Fathers trusted the people to do what is right, and that is true in this case too. – Lorica
“No. Theres no way to gaurentee it. But starting off with honest conseling, un-skewed consoling, has got to be better.”
The start counseling. Stop telling me about it.
“See Andrew that is the problem. You see the people as a political party. That just isn’t true. The Founding Fathers trusted the people to do what is right, and that is true in this case too. – Lorica”
You trust majorities exerting government force: Faction. I trust individuals.
No Andrew I trust people. Even people such as yourself. I do not, nor will I ever just follow the crowd which is what you are insinuating, which I don’t particularly care for. It seems to me that a person who is calling a specific vote amongst many individuals a faction or perhaps a mob mentality is fearful that his thinking is out of the mainstream. Think about what you said. Is that why we have prisons because of the exertion of government force??? Maybe we should just let all the criminally minded out of prison so that we won’t put undue exertion on them. Hate to have such stress on criminals don’t cha know. You are quick with the pat answers but they really are not making any sense. Perhaps from here on out we should just let the individuals you trust preform their own surgeries. Set their own rules, make their own laws. That’s it Andrew, I think you hit on something. Scripture says something about this mentality. It says that each individual did what was right in his own eyes. Good luck with that – Lorica
Lorica: I’m talking about abortion here. Nothing else.
Your obsessed…
“Your obsessed…”
As evidenced by a discussion of abortion on a post about abortion. of course!
Well Bak you got one of them to admit he is obsessed. Congratulations.
Abortion has grown so far out of the orginal intent of Roe Vs Wade it is ridiculous to believe that this is just about abortion. This is about a mentality that is always wanting the most convienient way out of it’s problems. Abortions at home. 30 years ago do you think that was the intent of Roe, to have No Medical personel overseeing for the safety of the patient?? Do we know any adverse effects this drug has with any other drug?? Can we trust the FDA to give us all the information about this drug?? Can we trust the FDA?? They wanted one of these drugs sold over the counter. Do you see where I am going Andrew?? We need to relook at this topic. We need to look into the FDA. I want to know how an FDA approved drug is killing people, Viaox. THen I want to know why there is no FDA responsiblity for these drugs. People have died from this type of drug Andrew. I want to know why, before we continue. – Lorica
I don’t get it.
It’s really simple to me.
If you are against abortion then you should not get one. But if you are against freedom you’re a traitor. Freedom is the ability to choose or determine your future. Self determination is not a new concept. Our country was founded on it.
If you want to push your religous beliefs on others you are no better than than the Taliban.
A religious zealot in America is no different than a religous zealot in Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan. In the end all religious zealots are a danger to freedom, equality, justice and democracy.
Frankly as a man I think I tend to stay away from issues that belong to women. Men don’t get abortions so it stands to reason that we should let the ladies deal with this one by themselves. And if it’s as simple as a pill and a visit with a physician then that’s progress.
The counseling argument is based on the idea that women are stupid and incapable of self determination. The fact of the matter is that women mature far faster than men, are more cerebral than men and generally are harder working than men. So it’s probably not necessary to counsel them at all in the first place.
As far as safety is concerned professional abortions are no more dangerous than a vasectomy or breast implants. And as for drugs. People die every year from antibiotics, heart medication, anti-depressants. So what!
4 million children die of starvation every year and here we are bantering about the ones that are not even taken their first breath of life.
Responsible sexual behavior should be taught in the home not regulated by the government.
We all know that those who oppose the right to choose have no intention whatsoever to care for or rear the children of unwanted pregnancies. And the state welfare systems are full of children already. Pro-lifers may wave a flag of self-righteousness but in the end they will ultimately turn their back on the children they forced women into having.
Even my own sister is going to China to adopt a baby because she does not want a black or hispanic baby even though they are plentiful here in America, she wants a white baby but is willing to settle for an asian baby. But she would swear up and down that she hasn’t a racist bone in her body. Do you believe her?
GBA obviously didn’t read what was pointed out and said this, The counseling argument is based on the idea that women are stupid and incapable of self determination. The fact of the matter is that women mature far faster than men, are more cerebral than men and generally are harder working than men. So it’s probably not necessary to counsel them at all in the first place.
“Nearly 80% of the women surveyed believed they were denied information or were actively misinformed by their counselors prior to their abortions … nearly 50% complained that they were not told about fetal development.”
It has NOTHING to do with saying any woman is stupid, those are your words and not what we are pointing out. They probably don’t even need counceling in the first place? HELLO?!? These women are under going a medical procedure, they should be informed of any risks and possible side effects that will cause them harm or adverse reactions in the future. Just because they mature faster than men does not mean they know everything in the world, they still need to know the risks and probelms involved.
Even so, 80 percent, yes, 80 percent believe they were denied proper information and/or was misinformed.
You can be as mature and smart as you can be, but you still need facts given to you. Unless ever woman is an expert in OBGYN and abortions. If not, they need to be informed.
Ok this is just an assinine statement in itself and has already been refuted earlier.
Do you know the statistics on who many abortions each year?
Approximately 1,370,000 abortions occur annually in the U.S., Link
Also, 4 million children die a year of starvation? Please give me proof because it seems you pulled that one out of an orifice.
About the only thing in which you posted I agree on.
There are many options available besides killing a baby because the person was having unprotected sex.
Personal responsibility does not mean getting rid of what you created.
If I am to take care of you when you get to old to care for yourself, does that mean I can just up and “abort” you as a senior citizen? Yes, it may seem like a reach, but how many senior citizen when they get to old have other backs turned to them are put in homes? Yes, I used it as an extreme example to what you are saying to show just how rediculous it sounds.
One should not abort life because they don’t want to be inconvienenced.
What you sister wants in adoption is her choice. If she wants white, blue green, orange, whatever…it is her choice.
Adoption doesn’t mean adopting the first child shoved at you and there is a process.
Also, to revert back to what you said earlier:
Ok, this also is a rediculous notion.
If your against freedom, then first off, your in the wrong damn country to start with.
Second, if your against freedom, and if you are you an idiot, then you most likly a lover of the communists system where you have no freedoms.
What this country was founded on was FREEDOM. The whole basis of why this country was started was based on FREEDOM. The founding fathers fled an oppressive king to be free and establish a society based on those freedom, which they wrote the Constitution and Bill of Rights to ensure those Freedoms.
“Do we know any adverse effects this drug has with any other drug?? Can we trust the FDA to give us all the information about this drug?? Can we trust the FDA?? They wanted one of these drugs sold over the counter. Do you see where I am going Andrew?? We need to relook at this topic. We need to look into the FDA”
Hey, I’m all for effective regulation of drug safety.
I’ve heard that this pill is fatal to the baby almost 100% of the time. That doesn’t sound safe to me.
Sanity,
I hear you.
And I did pull that number out of my a$$. I was wrong. It’s not 4,000,000 dead children it’s actually 6,000,000 dead children accoring to the United Nations.
http://www.fao.org/documents/show_cdr.asp?url_file=//docrep/005/y7352e/y7352e03.htm
Women don’t need counseling for abortion. Maybe they did when it first was legalized nationally but nobody lives in a vacuum anymore. Ignorance is not an excuse.
I honestly think that if a woman gets pregnant and wants to have an abortion then everyone else should mind their own busniess. Dont all humans have the right to do as they please when it comes to a subject like this..I also would like to add that if at home abortions werent safe they wouldnt have them read more into your facts before you sit here and judge people. what about the women who cant afford to have a child do you want that child to put into some foster home to be molested or have something bad happen to them. think before you judge, get your facts before you make a comment.